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SPIEGEL Interview with Portuguese Prime Minister José Sócrates

'The European Project Is One of the Grandest Ideas in the World'

Portuguese Prime Minister and current European Council President José Sócrates talks about the Lisbon Treaty, Europe's trouble with Russia and Brussels' engagement with Africa.

Sócrates, 50, a civil engineer by trade, is the secretary-general of the Socialist Party and has headed Portugal's government since March 2005. In June, Portugal assumed the rotating six month presidency of the European Union. And at an EU summit next month in Lisbon, the treaty that succeeded the failed European draft constitution is expected to be signed.

SPIEGEL: Mr. Prime Minister, after the October European Union summit you spoke of a great "victory" in reference to the newly negotiated EU reform treaty, to be signed in Lisbon on Dec. 13, which will replace the failed European constitution. Why do you see this as a victory?

Sócrates: Europe had to overcome its institutional crisis. The best signal that we could give to European citizens, European industry and the entire world was that we had agreed to a more efficient decision-making framework. This is the only way that Europe will be capable of playing an important role in global affairs.

SPIEGEL: How is the average European supposed to take notice of this? The new treaty is even more incomprehensible than the old one.

Sócrates: It will be palpable everywhere. Most decisions can now be approved with a qualified majority and no longer require the consensus of all 27 member states. Citizens can now expect to see Europe react more swiftly.

SPIEGEL: Warsaw was the biggest malcontent in the run-up to the summit. How did you manage to win over the Poles? Does Portugal have an especially deep understanding of the concerns of Eastern European countries?

Sócrates: The situation simply required professional diplomacy. We are neither a confederation nor a mere alliance; we are a union. We couldn't isolate the Poles; we had to include them without going back on earlier agreements. The creative solution was to make an exception for the Poles that was legally valid, yet not part of the text of the treaty.

SPIEGEL: This means that, at least until 2014, Poland will have more influence on the EU Council of Ministers than it is entitled to according to the size of its population. Do you expect that the new government in Warsaw will improve the political climate?

Sócrates: This agreement alone has improved it. The alternative would have been to remain totally empty-handed. Allowing exemptions for certain countries was the only way to reach an agreement. I just hope that the United Kingdom and Poland will come completely on board soon. Fortunately, the new Polish prime minister has already announced that he would like to accept the EU Charta of Fundamental Rights, which has been sidelined up to now.

SPIEGEL: In reality, the Lisbon Treaty marks a developmental threshold. For the time being, we will not pursue the dream of building a European superpower. Taxes, social welfare and foreign policy will remain in the hands of the individual member states. And there will be no common flag, no anthem. Is Europe renouncing its aim of acting as a single political unit?

Sócrates: I also liked the original draft constitution better, and I also feel that symbols are important. But Europe has always made progress step-by-step through compromises. I was born with Europe, in 1957; one year after Portugal entered the EU, I was elected to parliament. For me and my generation, the European project is one of the grandest ideas in the world. Our continent has experienced the horrors of war like no other, and this has marked us. And that's why over the past 50 years we've done everything in our power to build trust among ourselves. We've created a civil society that can move freely without border constraints.

SPIEGEL: Europe's ability to act effectively has been particularly put to the test in its relations with Russia. The main issues are energy, flyover rights, meat imports and security. Moscow effortlessly manages to drive a wedge between the EU countries. Do you really believe there is still a chance of reaching a new joint partnership agreement?

Sócrates: I think it's possible. It's in the interest of both sides to have a reliable political framework. Since the fall of the Wall in 1989, we have contributed to stability in the Soviet Union's former sphere of influence in Eastern Europe. However, I'm concerned about the differences that we have with Russia, most recently again with regard to defense issues. Europe's only option is to reach a compromise.

SPIEGEL: There is no common position within the EU on Russia.

Sócrates: It will be a long time before we have a common foreign policy in all areas.

SPIEGEL: What is the next step in the process of EU enlargement? After the accession of Romania and Bulgaria, EU members agreed that it was time to take a pause for reflection. Would that make Croatia the last country that could join, at least for the time being?

Sócrates: In recent years, Europe has learned that it's sometimes better not to rush into things. We need to take time to gain experience with our newly created institutions. Nonetheless, we cannot simply forget the commitments that we've made to those countries that are already engaged in membership negotiations.

SPIEGEL: You're also referring to Turkey?

Sócrates: Europe has to stand by its promise. If the country fulfills our criteria, we have to let it in. If not, it remains outside.

SPIEGEL: There are plans to lift all border checks for eight Eastern European countries and Malta by Christmas. Some fear that this will be too early.

Sócrates: We've promised to extend the area of free movement to the accession countries. However, it seemed impossible to link their databases with the Schengen system. So the Portuguese interior minister asked a domestic company to develop the right software, and they succeeded. This allows us to celebrate the historic opening of borders to Eastern Europe ahead of schedule. On Dec. 21, I will travel with German Chancellor Angela Merkel to the German-Polish border to officially mark the end of all passport controls. Thus, we Portuguese have also contributed to a Europe that is virtually without inner borders.